I bought a 2018 SG Special a while back. I really wasn't thrilled about the mini humbuckers that came in it. Just today I purchased a set of 2022 Gibson P90'S to swap into it. The original mini humbuckers just seemed so dark. Plus, the P90'S in a Special just seems right. I like clean tones. Maybe some of you are familiar with the 2018 Special model, sometimes referred to as the bankruptcy model. Give me your thoughts.
Am I nuts!
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ChubbyFingers
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I just bought an Epi Special with P90s. It's the fourth Epi I've bought - the others being a LP, a V and an ES-335 - and it's the only one I've not taken an instant dislike to the pickups on.
DrBGood
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OldDog
Active Member
No. Not nuts at all. A guitar with a different tone makes you play differently. Maybe to compliment the pickups and the whole feel of the guitar. Even with the same piece of music. I guess it brings out your mojo.
Col Mustard
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I love my SG with mini hums... Mine's from 2012 but
I don't think they've changed the minis.
And I think it's strange that you'd describe their tone as dark.
That seems like an EQ problem, nothing to do with the pickups.
You haven't said what amp you're using. Or what you're doing
with the controls. Or if you're tuned a step low... or what.
If your guitar was built in 2018, maybe the workers were worried about
losing their jobs if the company blew up and sank. Maybe there's a
sloppy solder joint in your controls that prevents your tone controls from
functioning right. But I think yours has a PCB. Anyway, that's easy to check.
Mini humbuckers have the capability of picking up high frequency tones
as well as midrange and low frequency tones. At least mine do.
The clean tones on my 2012 SG with mini hums are sparkling and beautiful,
no mud, no ice pick, they can growl or shriek. They can jangle or crank.
My SG with minis sounds so good, I left it completely stock, electronics
as issued, Nashville bridge and Corian Nut. It's a unique sound that
made a place for itself in my music.
That said, an SG with P-90s gives one of the classic tones...
Hard to go wrong with that. So if you've already bought the P-90s and
are determined to install them, you'll end up with a great sounding SG.
Read carefully all the posts on this forum by DrBGood... he knows how
to help guys get the best out of P-90s.
I've done that, and his methods work great on my Epiphone ES-339 that
is armed with P-90s. I have a lot of respect for the good doctor.
So you see I've done what many here on ETSG would recommend.
I've got both the minis and the P-90s. Their tones are different, but
both excellent.
I don't think they've changed the minis.
And I think it's strange that you'd describe their tone as dark.
That seems like an EQ problem, nothing to do with the pickups.
You haven't said what amp you're using. Or what you're doing
with the controls. Or if you're tuned a step low... or what.
If your guitar was built in 2018, maybe the workers were worried about
losing their jobs if the company blew up and sank. Maybe there's a
sloppy solder joint in your controls that prevents your tone controls from
functioning right. But I think yours has a PCB. Anyway, that's easy to check.
Mini humbuckers have the capability of picking up high frequency tones
as well as midrange and low frequency tones. At least mine do.
The clean tones on my 2012 SG with mini hums are sparkling and beautiful,
no mud, no ice pick, they can growl or shriek. They can jangle or crank.
My SG with minis sounds so good, I left it completely stock, electronics
as issued, Nashville bridge and Corian Nut. It's a unique sound that
made a place for itself in my music.
That said, an SG with P-90s gives one of the classic tones...
Hard to go wrong with that. So if you've already bought the P-90s and
are determined to install them, you'll end up with a great sounding SG.
Read carefully all the posts on this forum by DrBGood... he knows how
to help guys get the best out of P-90s.
I've done that, and his methods work great on my Epiphone ES-339 that
is armed with P-90s. I have a lot of respect for the good doctor.
So you see I've done what many here on ETSG would recommend.
I've got both the minis and the P-90s. Their tones are different, but
both excellent.
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Gary Gretsch
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This has nothing to do with this post, But ChubbyFingers I have a Epiphone Billie Joe Armstrong Les Paul Junior and I think the pickup in that guitar sounds better than the pickup in my 2021 SG Junior.
Gary Gretsch
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I have a Epiphone Crestwood Custom with mini humbuckers in it and I think they sound great. Close to the sound of the P90. I really like the mini humbuckers.
I wonder if we're talking about the same pickups. The mini's in my 2018 Special are wound crazy high. DCR's of 24.5 on the bridge and 16.9 for the neck. I like clean tones myself. These sound muddy to my ears. I have a set of Seth Lovers in a PRS SE and a set of Lollar mini humbuckers in another. Both of them sound sweet and clear when I want clean tones and dirty when I need dirt. As far as amps I have an Egnater Tweaker 15, a Supro Blues King 12 and a Quilter 101r.
Anyway, I expect the P90'S to give me from clean to dirty just the way I like. Actually decided on Gibson P90'S because it's a Gibson and for resale in the future. It is a PCB guitar which makes it handy as far as swapping pickups. Plug and play.
Col Mustard
Well-Known Member
well you won't regret installing the P-90s, especially when you've got the equipment you describe and the other guitars to cover the tones of
the Gibson mini hums. P-90s will add great tones to what you already
are using IMHO. You don't need a second set of minis, especially if they don't play right through your equipment.
But I wouldn't trust those resistance numbers, unless you've got the p'ups out of the guitar. Those numbers are not what Gibson published as their spec.
the Gibson mini hums. P-90s will add great tones to what you already
are using IMHO. You don't need a second set of minis, especially if they don't play right through your equipment.
But I wouldn't trust those resistance numbers, unless you've got the p'ups out of the guitar. Those numbers are not what Gibson published as their spec.
I don't know about that. I've seen more than one YouTube review where the reviewer mentioned the same numbers, so I think they're legit. Also I've gotten very much the same numbers when checking resistance of pickups both in and out of guitars before, so even though they seem crazy high I'm pretty certain.
Decadent Dan
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From what I found in 2018 mini humbucker sold listings, the 2018 Rhy Mini (16.4k) and Lead Mini (25k) in SG’s are much hotter than the same year Rhy Tribute (6.2k) and Lead Tribute (?) in LP’s.
That's consistent with what I measured. Even though Gibson described them as having bright crisp tones they are nothing like a good vintage PAF type sound. They sound as you would expect way over wound pickups to sound. Very strong mids, but lacking in clear high tones. Not bright and crisp.
Exactly what I have, and the Lead mini 860-17059 in the bridge. Good for metal or that sort of thing, I guess.
funkysoul1
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Its been a month or so that i swap a set of p90s from my SG Special 2019 with a set of mini hums from an SG Special 2016. I have measured them both around 6,8K against the p90s that was around 8k.so i have better cleans for sure and less hum.... But the p90s can hold better the dirt... We cant have it all
Col Mustard
Well-Known Member
Here's what Gibson says about the output of their various pickups
including the mini humbucker:
It's not a very large file, so it doesn't look good enlarged
But you can see that the minis are rated lower in output
than most of them. And that's been my experience.
The cleans are lovely, but the SG will rip when you crank them up.
The only reason I'm saying this is that it seems to me the problem of your tone is likely from some other electronic source, not the intensity of
the output. These are NOT Firebird pickups. Or they are not supposed to be.
If the P-90s go in and you still don't get good tone, it won't be their fault either IMHO. Except that on Gibson's chart, they are listed as
hotter than the mini humbucker. *shrugs
But I love my P-90 sound, just like I love my minis.
I'm glad I have both. Through my amp and speakers their output
seems very close.
Fralin mini-hums have a good reputation. I wonder what their output is. I'll bet it's similar.
including the mini humbucker:
It's not a very large file, so it doesn't look good enlarged
But you can see that the minis are rated lower in output
than most of them. And that's been my experience.
The cleans are lovely, but the SG will rip when you crank them up.
The only reason I'm saying this is that it seems to me the problem of your tone is likely from some other electronic source, not the intensity of
the output. These are NOT Firebird pickups. Or they are not supposed to be.
If the P-90s go in and you still don't get good tone, it won't be their fault either IMHO. Except that on Gibson's chart, they are listed as
hotter than the mini humbucker. *shrugs
But I love my P-90 sound, just like I love my minis.
I'm glad I have both. Through my amp and speakers their output
seems very close.
Fralin mini-hums have a good reputation. I wonder what their output is. I'll bet it's similar.
Sort of a generic chart. As Decadent Dan noted there are Gibson mini's and other Gibson mini's. The mini's in my 2018 Special are of the very overwound type. As I said 24.5 and 16.9 k ohms. I am not mistaken in this. I know how to measure the DCR, both in and out of the guitar. This is verifiable, not only by myself but several Youtubers have reviewed the same guitar and have noted that same values.
MR D
Well-Known Member
IIRC (Big "IF"), that's the one I liked because it has the 1st fret inlay, which is unusual for a USA line GIBSON solid body electric......ITSSA KEEPER !
MR D
Well-Known Member
U R CORRECT. I hav a set of Mini H-Buckers in a 2018 FIREBIRD Standard and they measure 15+ @ Neck and 23+ @ Bridge... the new Mini's are HI-OUTPUT, according to the spec sheet....they scream but lack the umpff on the LOW END. U can tell when you hit an open E or F/F# BARRE CHORDS........they is just not heavy enough.
Right! I like the small block inlays with the one at the 1st fret too.
