MIJ sg suggestions

SG standard

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I hate epi's (except MIJ ones) cause they sound dull.
...everything else could be swapped in time.
To be honest, I don't quite understand why you'd be happy to buy anything other than an Epi & swap out parts, but not buy an Epi & swap out parts...

When it comes to Gibsons, they have no 'magic' way of producing guitars cheaply in the USA - you'll always be paying for the higher cost of labour compared to Korea, China, Mexico, Indonesia, etc. For equal prices, you're likely to get better quality parts/finishes on a non-USA model, but nothing is guaranteed, especially on budget models where quality may vary more - whether it's parts, finish, QC. etc. Note that this does NOT apply to Japanese production; Japanese manufacturers are also forced to produce outside Japan due to labour costs, MiJ models like the Yamaha SG are expensive. Fender MiJ are more expensive than Fender MiM.

As for Gibson's quality control, several dealers I've spoken to, or I've heard comment on the subject, said it has improved in recent years, particularly in 2015.
 

striker

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All that being said, I have a Grass Roots LP that is a damn fine instrument. I'm sure they make a SG model. Might be an option in your price range.

I do have a grass roots lp and for the price this guitar is stuning. Quality built is so much better than epiphone standard, sound wise I kind of like it but for me it lacks a bit of low end tone but its just character I would say. Tunners and nut are a bit crappy, action nice and low, beautifull sustain, nitro finish, maple veneer.
I dig this guitar but with this next buy I want to go a step further atleast tone wise. I love the sound of original SG's and I dont want to go in compromise in this case. I can deal with aesthetics and look of the guitar but tone is the king.
 

striker

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To be honest, I don't quite understand why you'd be happy to buy anything other than an Epi & swap out parts, but not buy an Epi & swap out parts...

After all Epi's that Ive touched in my life, I promissed my self that i would NEVER EVER get an epiphone till it's mij. I just cant stand them, sgs are horibble. Ive never seen one without ridiculous neckdive, I hate the headstock, I hate everythins about them. Still Epi Les Paul standards are allright, some of them ive tried had a really good town, they are not built briliantly, I would say grass roots are way ahead for the building quality, but some of those epis can really be comparable with original gibsons tone wise. For the money you would buy an epi + swap all electronics and hardware you could easily get atleast second hand sg special by gibson and I guess it would sound much better and would hold its price if you would want to sell it.
 

Gibsg

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My 2003 Gibson SG Special have a 1 piece body


sg_fad14.jpg
,

I' m agree with Striker,

I don' t like Epiphone G400,Les Paul, Vee .... The wood is bad qualiy and light , hardware is cheap and humbuckers are very bad.
Tuners, potentiometers, switch, ... are bad quality .

The body is made of 6 or 7 parts wih an horrible photoflame finish.

Sorry but those poor Epîphone are bad guitars and they are expensive . I' m talking about G400, LP, Firebird and Vee-like. Other models like Casino are interesrting !


Epiphone G400 is 300 €uro, that' s expensive regarding to a real Gibson SG Special
 
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PermissionToLand

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My advice is forget whatever you heard about one piece bodies because it doesn't matter at all. My Gibson was $3000+ new and guess what? It sounds no better than my $250 Samick with a three piece body. (And P.S., Samick made many an Epiphone)

Barring any serious structural flaws, you can make any electric guitar play and sound however you want. So don't worry about what snobs or people talking down any respected brand's quality tell you. Every brand has lemons. Very few brands make guitars that are genuinely bad today. Buy whatever has the features you want at the price you want and if it doesn't play or sound the way you want, you can always fix that. Pickups are THE determining factor in tone when it comes to electrics. A single piece body will not make any guitar "brighter" or "darker" than another.

And if a three piece body (on a factory reject) is good enough to be Slash's Number 1, it's good enough for us:
passport1.jpg


Still sounds pretty fuckin great to me!
 

Gibsg

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My Gibson was $3000+ new and guess what? It sounds no better than my $250 Samick

Nice joke !

An other one please :rofl:

A body made of 4 pieces is not a problem, if the wood is high quality with good assembly that' s perfect !
 
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Gillean

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Nice joke !

An other one please :rofl:

A body made of 4 pieces is not a problem, if the wood is high quality with good assembly that' s perfect !


I must say I also find very hard to believe... and I`ve been there.

Started with an epi special -> g400 -> sg special -> sg standard.

Still have the last 3.

The g400 is completely upgraded and it still does not sound quite like the Gibson special (which is also a little upgraded).

The only place I can vouch for the statement '"no difference in sound" is between the Special and Standard, they don`t sound the same, definitely not, but they don`t sound better than the other, just different.

On the other Hand, from the epi special to the G400 there was already quite a jump in quality of sound and playability/quality and a noticeable jump from the g400 to the special/standard (in different directions for each[different, not opposite]).
 

Gibsg

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You really want a nice SG copy ?

Check for Edwards-Navigator guitars !


s-l1600.jpg
 

PermissionToLand

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Nice joke !

An other one please :rofl:

A body made of 4 pieces is not a problem, if the wood is high quality with good assembly that' s perfect !

Son, I own the guitars. This is a fact. I've even considered selling the Gibson because frankly, I could get several other guitars with the money, but it's a rare color and sentimentality is not rational.

Maybe I'll post some audio and dare you to tell me which is which. But I know you'd run and hide anyway, if I were to call your bluff.

I must say I also find very hard to believe... and I`ve been there.

Started with an epi special -> g400 -> sg special -> sg standard.

Still have the last 3.

The g400 is completely upgraded and it still does not sound quite like the Gibson special (which is also a little upgraded).

The only place I can vouch for the statement '"no difference in sound" is between the Special and Standard, they don`t sound the same, definitely not, but they don`t sound better than the other, just different.

On the other Hand, from the epi special to the G400 there was already quite a jump in quality of sound and playability/quality and a noticeable jump from the g400 to the special/standard (in different directions for each[different, not opposite]).

Not all cheap guitars are created equal, I had a G-400 that was a total dog; an early Chinese model, before they really had enough experience under their belt at that factory. Mostly fretwork issues that made it not worth upgrading or spending the money to fix.

When you say "completely", that includes the pots, caps, switch, pickups and nut? And had the frets ever been filed and truss rod adjusted? With a proper setup, any Epiphone can have action just as low as a Gibson and play just as smooth.

If it doesn't sound as good as anything after that, you either picked the wrong pickups or it's a case of confirmation bias. I personally experienced this when I accidentally uploaded the same audio file twice in what was supposed to be a comparison, and I insisted there was a difference until I saw the wavelengths were identical and realized my mistake! The human mind is a powerful tool...

https://cascience6isp.wikispaces.com/file/view/CaseyS2013.pdf
 

PermissionToLand

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You really want a nice SG copy ?

Check for Edwards-Navigator guitars !

But wait, that's a garbage COPY guitar!

Nice to see you've finally admitted you were WRONG. :rofl:

You must be really lonely to keep coming here when almost everyone has blocked you by now...
 

Gillean

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Son, I own the guitars. This is a fact. I've even considered selling the Gibson because frankly, I could get several other guitars with the money, but it's a rare color and sentimentality is not rational.

Maybe I'll post some audio and dare you to tell me which is which. But I know you'd run and hide anyway, if I were to call your bluff.



Not all cheap guitars are created equal, I had a G-400 that was a total dog; an early Chinese model, before they really had enough experience under their belt at that factory. Mostly fretwork issues that made it not worth upgrading or spending the money to fix.

When you say "completely", that includes the pots, caps, switch, pickups and nut? And had the frets ever been filed and truss rod adjusted? With a proper setup, any Epiphone can have action just as low as a Gibson and play just as smooth.

If it doesn't sound as good as anything after that, you either picked the wrong pickups or it's a case of confirmation bias. I personally experienced this when I accidentally uploaded the same audio file twice in what was supposed to be a comparison, and I insisted there was a difference until I saw the wavelengths were identical and realized my mistake! The human mind is a powerful tool...

https://cascience6isp.wikispaces.com/file/view/CaseyS2013.pdf

completely means completely, only the wood is still original. Even the cosmetical stuff were upgraded.
there is something about it in this OLD thread: http://www.everythingsg.com/threads/sg-orange-sound.21152/#post-281911

I`m sure the case is not about the mind crazy things, although I acknowledge its existence. It was confirmed by many other players, most of which played other instruments.

I wish I could make a video to show you the diference, sadly, since I moved to Europe, I only have my gibson special with me, all other guitars are still in Brazil, in the good hands of my brother (I hope).
 

SG standard

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The human mind is a powerful tool...
Indeed, but powerful at creating a subjective reality, rather than experiencing an objective one. If our perceptions were all the same this forum would lose about 90% of its content. No more debates about tonewoods, pickups, amps or the different tone you get from a nitro finish. :) The really amazing bit is how we're taken by it all.

That research paper doesn't even scratch the surface.
 

jlee

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I own a early Bacchus BSG from their handmade line and a 90s Greco SG Special. Both were purchased for more than your budget though.

I did own a late 80s Burny that was super affordable at the time. Not sure what current prices are at. It was a fantastic guitar after upgrading the electronics. Stock pickups weren't bad after replacing the pots and caps. Great instrument. Comparable to my Greco, but not the Bacchus which is more than comparable to a Gibson '61RI. The Burny now belongs to a friend who owns a monster '61 RI. He loves the Burny and uses it just as much as the '61.
 

kiko

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I suggest you reconsider epiphone as an option. They do have models that sounds just fine.
 

striker

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Thank's guys for all of your opinions and help. Yesterday got my self a tokai sg jr mij. I can't believe how good it is. The build quality is something ive never seen or touched. It is very lightweight, the sustain is brilliant, super low action, very comfy neck, fretboad is reall nice aswell. Love the simplicity and looks of it. I didn't have time to try it on my valve amp, but tried it all my small bedroom yamaha amp and it sounds killer. I was expecting that this is going to be a really good guitar, but honestly, Im shocked how amazing it is. I'll drop couple of pics later.
 


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